1st trip to Vegas - Caught a dealer cheating (maybe) you decide.
My wifes seminar was at the Tuscany so we decided we didn't want to take a cab a few times a day and stayed there on Fri and Sat. Don't stay at Tuscany it smelled sooooooo bad and was very over priced.
DAY ONE
About 2am I couldn't sleep so I went down and put my name on the 1/2 NL game. I watched the game, it was a loose loose, crazy game.
While I was waiting I saw a professor from UNLV call 200 cold pre flop with 9c7c and ended up knocking the other guy out that had KK when he flopped a trips and then filled up on the river.
Anyway, I was tired but having fun. It was a wild game with surprisingly alot of cash on the table. One of the dealers rotated in and he was very good with a deck of cards. He was also very flashy. When he got a tip he would tap his chip on the table and then throw it up onto his shoulder and let it slide down into his pocket.
One hand two players did a showdown with both black aces. When the other player tipped the guy threw it up on his shoulder and let it slide down. With his other hand he flipped the two aces together and flicked them back into his chip tray seperate from the other cards. He then brought the deck close to the aces and shuffled, spread the deck out a bit so it was messy and then grabbed the aces, spread them out two and slid them onto the bottom of the deck with cards inbetween them. At this point I was staring at the deck watching..watching and he started to cut the deck many times. I lost what was going on and couldn't follow anything else.
The next hand a regular there got those two black aces. Now, I played a few more hands and then left. I didn't say anything because I don't want to accuse anyone of something that they didn't do and because I couldn't follow what the guy was doing. I was suspicious enough that I would have liked to stand there and watch more but I was to tired. All in all I won't play there again. I also don't want to accuse anyone of anything and ruin some guys job/image if I wasn't positive. Would you guys have done anything different?
DAY TWO: CEASERS PALACE
Played here for about 12 hours. Was down just a bit. It was a good game, not crazy and not too tight. Had fun, I didn't realize there was no max on the 2/5 game until some guy sat down with 500 in chips and 7k behind in bills.
DAY THREE: MANDALAY BAY - BEST STORY
Got there about 8:30 and there was a full table, within 30 min there was only 3 of us on the 2/4 table. A drunk guy that had been up all night came over to make 4. He was showing his bluffs and going all in every 3 hands. I was waiting when him and another fella got into a huge pot. There was about 500 in the pot and the drunk guy had another 1000 in front while the other guy had about 350 left. The river hits and the drunk guy goes all in. The other fella hems and haws for a while and then turns his hole cards over showing a weak ace that was paired with another ace on the board. He tells the drunk guy while considering, "Ya know, I really feel like this is the best hand." The drunk guy laughs and says, "Well, you were right my friend" and turns over his 34o. The guy with the aces sits there a second, looks at his cards then looks at the other guys cards and says, "Okay, then I CALL" - The drunk guy was stunned, the dealer counts out his chips and tells the drunk guy he owes another 350 and pushes the 850 toward the non drunk fella.
At this point the drunk guy got so mad and beligerent they had to call 4 security guards to take him out. I was pleading with the guy to relax and just play poker it was a mistake and we just want to play. (Only because I was sure he would be broke in 30 min) No dice, they had to haul him away because he was swearing at the guy, saying he had no honor he shouldn't accept that pot, it was a mistake he won....etc...
DAY THREE: MANDALAY BAY
Played for a few hours while waiting for my plane. I was up for the trip and on my very last hand I flopped a King high flush ended up in the pot with all my chips and two others. One fella had the ACE high flush and I lost one buy in for the trip.
Summary:
I can't wait to go back. Mandalay Bay rooms were awesome, Mandalay poker was good. Tuscany poker = bad. Tuscany rooms = very bad.
Ceasers poker = good.
I'll play venetian and mgm grand next time.
Thanks everyone.
Googlie




I'm fairly certain I know of the Tuscany dealer you're referring to, guy w/ a medium build, short black hair and goatee. Very personable, very quick w/ the cards and can cut out a side pot faster than anyone I've ever seen.
He knows all the regulars by name and plays there sometimes when he's not on the clock. I can't say I ever saw anything suspicious so I'm not going to assume there's anything going on.
Aren't tips supposed to go into the tip container and not his pocket? This shouldn't be allowed in a casino. The drunk guy learned a lession, don't play drunk. The ace deal does sound fishy.
Standard shuffle in poker is Wash, Riffle Riffle Strip, Riffle (or Wash Riffle Strip Riffle Riffle) anything outside of this is suspicious. Any shuffle which is just multiple cutting of the deck would be very suspicious. So if this shuffle consisted of nothing but multiple deck cutting something was wrong.
No in Vegas, dealesr keep there own tips. In many rooms they pocket there tips. In other rooms they may have a tip container but that is generally for their convenience.
It was very fishy, when the Aces ended up seperated from the other cards and he put them into the bottom of the deck I was suspicious. When the regular there got those two aces I was more suspicious. He was shuffling, but it -looked- like the packet on the bottom was not being shuffled. And then the gazillion cuts came in and I lost track. They do use a cut card on the bottom so I had to ask myself if this guy was that good why would he be a dealer and not smashing up home games and such and also, what if he really didn't do anything and it was coincidence.
I certainly dont' want to accuse and be wrong. Thats why I didn't post up his name, or report it to the pit boss. I mean, if you are a dealer for a living and are accused of somethign like that it could be very damaging to your career. Word travels, I assume. If you're a cheat then so be it. Your busted and shouldn't, but I just thought to myself what if your wrong. What if you accuse this guy and it costs him his job or future jobs. I woudln't want to do that. So, I just thought that I won't play there and let the community know maybe something spooky is going on.
All my home game friends love the drunk guy story. I'll let the poker folks know at Majestic Star in Indiana this weekend. Something fun to talk about.
Googlie
If you suspect something like this there is nothing wrong with speaking to the Floorman (note Pit boss is not a term usually applied in a poker room) or manager. If you politely raise your your suspicions with management -- especially if you make it clear your not trying to get them to give you back money you lost) they can keep a closer eye on the dealer. I know of several instances where a player reporting a dealer stealing from the pot has lead to the dealer being caught.
This dealer is such a high profile guy and really seems to enjoy what he's doing (as if his life revolves around this job). Just seems hard to believe he'd risk it all by cheating, as I'm sure you'd be banished from all Vegas casinos (and a hard time finding employment elsewhere too w/ the tight security connections between casinos). Does sound a bit circumspect though.
Think about it. In order to deliver these cards to a particular player the dealer would need to either:
- be able to deal off the bottom of the deck with a cut card in place; or
- be able to precisely place the cards in the deck such that they'd get dealt to that player
I'm not saying that it's impossible. I think that there are people who can deal off the bottom of a deck even with a cut card in place. I think however that being able to manipulate a shuffle to put two cards in a particular place, cut the deck such that those cards are on the bottom and then deal off the bottom of the deck would require a number of movements that would arise suspicion. In other words in a casino environment with eye in the sky watching it's highly unlikely. Still possible but very highly unlikely.
In a backroom, self-dealt, high stakes game I'd be much more inclined to believe it.
If this dealer was cheating I would guess he was able to cut the cards at a specific spot so the Aces ended up on the top of the deck. Then he would just have to deal seconds until he got to the local player he wanted to have the Aces. Dealing seconds would be very easy for someone that could do the other 'card tricks' that you described.
I'm 99% sure I know who you're talking about. I stayed at the Tusk in January for CES and logged a bunch of hours there. That dealer is the single most memorable dealer I can recall from a number of trips to Vegas. The guy is super-personable and fantastically fast with the cards. I suppose if there is one guy I've seen who could pull off some mechanics, it would be this guy. That being said, I'd trust this guy at my table any day of the week. Like others have said, I doubt a pro dealer like this would jeapordize his job by stacking the dack at a low-limit game. I'm pretty sure this guy makes his money playing much bigger games around town.
True story about this dealer: late one night at the 1/2NL, I'm in the 3 seat with a mix of locals, conventioneers, and post-tourney people who stuck around for the cash game. The dealer we're discussing here is dealing the game, and the table is loose and fun. A young kid sits in the one seat, directly to the dealer's left. One particular hand, the action comes around to the kid after the flop, who sits there a LONG time and doesn't do a thing. The dealer quietly, to the kid, says "you're action, boss." The kid doesn't flinch and remains dead for a while longer. Again, the dealer says "your action", more loudly this time so he's sure the kid hears him. Totally pro about it. Then, out of right field, the kid mutters 1/2 under his breath, "I heard you the first time, a**hole." The dealer sits up straight in his chair and says "Did you just call me what I think you did?" And the kid says, "you heard me right, a**hole." -- !!! -- This kid was waaaaay out of line.
Things took a turn for the worse at that point. The dealer, doing his best to contain himself, asked for an apology. The kid replied "F-U". The verbal exchange escalated, and offers were made to take it outside. The kid was obviously in over his head with the dealer. Then for some stupid reason, the kid pushed his chair back and jumped up like he was ready to pop the dealer. A split second later, the dealer was up too and about to put his fist down the kid's throat. Then out of nowhere, the beligerant drunk in seat 2 grabbed the kid by the shoulders and slammed him into the wall (so hard I can't believe he didn't put him thru the wall). The floor manager had a hold of the dealer by then, and convinced him to sit back down while they hauled the kid outside. A short time later, the kid was gone and the dealer went on break.
Here's the best part: the dealer comes back to the game after his break and picks up the deck. I look at him dead in the eye and said "welcome back, a**hole." Holy sh*t did the table have a great laugh. Ended up being a great game and one of my most memorable nights playing poker in Vegas. Over the course of the week, I chatted with this dealer a lot. he remembered me by name every time I walked by the room. This guy is way OK in my book. A) he's a great dealer and B) he's one bada** mother f****r.
I'll be back in Vegas later this May for a friend's wedding. Our plan is to have a guy's night out the night before the wedding -- I've already suggested the Tusk as a good place to play BECAUSE of this dealer in particular. The Tuscany attracts a lot of regulars and a lot of players for their tournaments. Of all the rooms I've played in Vegas, it's the most like a home game I've been to. The management was very friendly as well. I'd recommend it if you want a room with good action, a good mix of players, and a staff that really appreciates your business. Like I said, the tourneys are very popular, and the structure is really good for a low buy-in game.
Outstanding!
Bullitt, glad to hear you also know of this dealer. He maintains great control over the tables during those tourneys, I like how he says in a mono-comanding tone~"all players turn over cards NOW!!" during All-ins and has great player recall. I've played there about a dozen different tourneys/sessions and had a Colorado Avalanche hat on during one tourney and a couple sessions. Saw him a 6 weeks later on our next Vegas trip and he said "wuzzup Colorado?" Not used to this kind of recall from casino dealers.
Have you ever seen someone cutout sidepots like this guy?
BTW, if you see him next time ask him if he still has his "Imperial Palace Carpet Shirt"
I would have a hrd time calling somebody a great dealer because they didn't handle a drunk who called them names properly.
I don't know this guy - never played at the Tuscany and he might otherwise be a great dealer, but this story illustrates his failure not his success.
As a dealer i have been in that position and I don't always handle it properly either, but I'm certainly not proud of it when i escalate a situation like that.
The dealer showed incredible restraint, but the kid kept provoking him. He called the floor early on, and held his tongue for the most part. He gave the kid every chance to set things right. The dealer never raised his voice, never even flinched until the other guy got out of his seat and got in the his face. At that point, it was self-defense. The kid causing the problems was not drunk as far as I could tell, just a young prick trying to act tough. He made the situation a lot worse by not apologizing when he had the chance.
The guy in the 2 seat was a class A beligerant drunk. Dirnk and a shot, drink and a shot... for hours. This guy was a complete a**shole, getting under people's skin. The dealer recognized that this drunk was burning thru a stack of $100's as fast as he was throwing back shots. He kept the drunk in check, kept the other players cool, and kept the drunk IN THE GAME until he left broke. To me, that's a dealer that's in control of his table.
@Bullitt5135
That strikes me as a better way of handling the situation. Though I still don't think he should have stood up. Of course if the floor was called early on the floor obviously screwed this one up by letting stuff get that point.
Yeah, I guess you had to be there. This whole thing probably went down in less than a minute. The floor manager was an older woman, and another moose of a guy came in from the back room just about the time they both got up. I seem to recall the managers telling both to settle down right as things exploded. It's not like the manager is going to dive across the table to tackle the customer or dealer over an arguement. The kid was totally the aggressor and instigator, and to me his actions were genuinely threatening. He literally jumped out of his chair and leaned into the dealer. I don't think any dealer would just sit there and calmly ask the floor to please remove the player when said player was about to pop him in the head.
The crazy thing is that this kid was quiet as a mouse the whole time he was there. He sat there with his head down and a ballcap pulled over his eyes. He picked a real bad time and place to be a dick. Yeah, the dealer probably would have been sent home if he was working at Bellagio or Wynn, if nothing else but to cool off. I guess what I liked about the Tusk is it had a "real" feel, even if it got a bit dodgy for a moment.
I noticed the O/P said the rooms at the Tuscany sucked. I stayed there for a week and really liked my room. Extra big, kitchenette, clean, no bad smell. I think it's a great choice for business travellers or if you have (and will be using) a car during your stay, since you can park close to your room. My company has already reserved a block of rooms for CES '08.
Glad to hear you liked your room, we rec'd some nice room deals lately so we'd like to give it a try. My wife likes the slot play she gets over there (much "looser" than strip slots) and I like the poker room, it's got a nice vibe and those low-dollar tourneys are a blast (for the turbo structure, lol) and the Mexican restaurant is very good.